Acetone test results megathread

[TheKavaSociety]

Re Lami Kava: I actually sent a sample of their "premium" kava to Garry a year ago (or so). He did a full analysis and it was noble and clean. Perhaps not very impressive in terms of potency (I think something around 5-6%? I cannot remember the exact %, but I remember that it wasn't strong), but pure roots and no aerial parts. That was before the cyclone affected their regular suppliers, so no idea what the results would be today.

 

[verticity]

...I can't confirm or deny ANYTHING ...

"In other news, True Kava in a statement said it cannot confirm or deny anything. It cannot even confirm or deny that there is any such organization as True Kava, or whether or not @Deleted User hacked anyone's email. Please stay tuned for the latest developments in this non-story..."
(^^^ It's a joke. )

 

[verticity]

So I did some futzing with the image of the card, and satisfied myself that the top row has roughly the same hue, and so does the bottom row.
Top row hues, left to right: 38, 44, 46, 49
Bottom row hues, L to R: 66, 62, 58
If you normalize the saturations, the top ones look basically the same, except for the leftmost one, which is exceptionally orange. The bottom ones look the same, too, but the leftmost one has a greenish tint.
The following are color swatches made with the hue of each filter in the card, with the saturation normalized to 95, and the value (illumination) normalized to 90. Those values were chosen so as not to either max out or zero out any of the RGB components. I did this really just for my own curiosity. I wouldn't recommend using these images on a computer monitor for any purpose.

That's what different hues look like like, folks!

 

[verticity]

Even more fun...

Spectra of filters:
View attachment 6975
CIE Chart:
View attachment 6976
Dominant wavelengths
1: 572.8975
2: 573.1437
3: 574.0837
4: 576.8303
5: 580.2706
6: 582.5490
7: 586.7740

Where do you buy the filters? What are the part numbers?

 

[Lami Kava]

Re Lami Kava: I actually sent a sample of their "premium" kava to Garry a year ago (or so). He did a full analysis and it was noble and clean, but not very impressive in terms of potency (I think something around 5-6%? I cannot remember the exact %, but I remember that it wasn't strong). But that was before the cyclone affected their regular suppliers, so no idea what the results would be today.

Bula @Henry - we have just sent our most recent batch for testing with Garry so I will let you know our results when we have them. Thanks for your interest!
Warm regards,
@Lami Kava

 

[kasa_balavu]

@Deleted User have you ever tested a Supercritical CO2 extract for nobility and chemotype? Would the method for such a test be much different to the testing of powdered kava?

 

[verticity]

@Deleted User have you ever tested a Supercritical CO2 extract for nobility and chemotype? Would the method for such a test be much different to the testing of powdered kava?

Ooh, I'll take this one. The method for chemotype would be the same. However, it is unknown whether the marker molecule (the tudei "orange molecule") or molecules would be extracted during the CO2 extraction process. So the acetone test might not work. You would need to do an HPLC test for flavokavain/kavalactone ratio to tell if CO2 extract is noble.

 

[kasa_balavu]

Thanks, guys.
Are you in disagreement?
Is there or is there not a way to determine nobility of a kavalactone paste such as the one briefly sold by GHK?
Feel free to assume you have access to a Johnson & Johnson pharmaceutical lab with state of the art lab tech at your disposal.

Bottom line, kava extract is not kava as we know it.

Agreed!

 

[Gourmet Hawaiian Kava]

Thanks, guys.
Are you in disagreement?
Is there or is there not a way to determine nobility of a kavalactone paste such as the one briefly sold by GHK?
Feel free to assume you have access to a Johnson & Johnson pharmaceutical lab with state of the art lab tech at your disposal.


Agreed!

I can say that the chemotype of my Mahakea powdered kava is different than the chemotype of the Mahakea CO2 extract and this is because that each kavalactone is extracted at different rates and concentrations with the CO2. So yes it does change the chemotype, yes it was noble before it was extracted and yes it was noble after but it did change the chemotype.
Aloha.

Chris

 

[verticity]

Thanks, guys.
Are you in disagreement?
Is there or is there not a way to determine nobility of a kavalactone paste such as the one briefly sold by GHK?
Feel free to assume you have access to a Johnson & Johnson pharmaceutical lab with state of the art lab tech at your disposal.


Agreed!

Well, you can test the chemotype. But the chemotype can be manipulated, so you can't be sure it is the chemotype of the source material.
You can test for flavokavains, but again, those can be manipulated.
Now if you measured KL and FK levels of some extract, and found that they were indicative of tudei, you could say "this extract was probably made from tudei, because why would anyone manipulate the levels to look like tudei?": But the converse is not true. If the measured FK and KL levels of an extract are the same as a noble kava, you cannot say "this extract was made from noble kava". It could be have been made from tudei anyway..
There is no genetic material in the extract, so you couldn't even do genetic testing.

So, yes, now that I think about it, I disagree with my above statement that you could test extracts for being noble, but you could test them for being not noble.

 

[kasa_balavu]

Well, you can test the chemotype. But the chemotype can be manipulated, so you can't be sure it is the chemotype of the source material.
You can test for flavokavains, but again, those can be manipulated.
Now if you measured KL and FK levels of some extract, and found that they were indicative of tudei, you could say "this extract was probably made from tudei, because why would anyone manipulate the levels to look like tudei?": But the converse is not true. If the measured FK and KL levels of an extract are the same as a noble kava, you cannot say "this extract was made from noble kava". It could be have been made from tudei anyway..
There is no genetic material in the extract, so you couldn't even do genetic testing.

So, yes, now that I think about it, I disagree with my above statement that you could test extracts for being noble, but you could test them for being not noble.

Thanks. That makes sense.

 

[Zaphod]

Well one would have to settle on a clear scientific and repeatable definition of noble first. Is it just KL/FL ratio? Is it total FL level per serving? Is it the yet to be identified molecule that has the orange hue in the acetonic test? Hard to claim an extract is noble until you have a solid definition....

 

[verticity]

Well one would have to settle on a clear scientific and repeatable definition of noble first. Is it just KL/FL ratio? Is it total FL level per serving? Is it the yet to be identified molecule that has the orange hue in the acetonic test? Hard to claim an extract is noble until you have a solid definition....

KL/FK ratio has been basically settled on as a metric for noble-tudei by kava scientists, although there is not yet a standard analytical method for measuring it. (But there are good methods for measuring it that are not official standards)