DEA Microgram on Kava Jan 2013

[Tyler]

The recent DEA microgram on Kava states that the DEA is basically building their case against Kava based upon Kava drinkers accounts of their experiences on the internet. I would like to remind the members of the Kava forum of the role that they play in keeping Kava legal and unregulated simply by changing the way that Kava is discussed on public forums such as this one. Reading through some of the posts on here, I see a lot of language that is used to describe illicit substances, in fact I see several mentions of illicit substances. Its essential to not compare Kava to XYZ substance or talk about how _______ Kava gets you. Lets discuss how we as a community can change the way that we talk about Kava to preserve its unregulated status and to keep it off the DEA's and FDA's radar.

 

[ApéroNoble]

Awesome find Tyler

 

[HeadHodge]

Hi Tyler,

I'm working on the Forums Kavapedia Digest. I would like to include a section in there for the AKA.
So I've added a Kavapedia Tag for you to use. It's called "AKA NEWS". Whenever you post a thread here that you would feel is appropriate to add to the Kavapedia, please add this tag to your thread. To do that, when you create the thread and give it a title, there should be a dropdown list box that displays the available thread prefixes. Just pick the "AKA NEWS" one. When you save your thread it should show up in the Kavapedia.

Maybe you could edit the thread title of this thread and add the tag as a test to make sure it works ok.

Thanks Much
HeadHodge

 

[ApéroNoble]

" Lets discuss how we as a community can change the way that we talk about Kava to preserve its unregulated status and to keep it off the DEA's and FDA's radar."

do you mean things like getting krunked etc?

Edit: Obviously you mean things like this. The question is how serious do you take this. Does everyone joining the site need a memo. Should we report post with anything we think may hurt. Should post be deleted with some of the above mentioned things you're speaking to.

 

[Tyler]

" Lets discuss how we as a community can change the way that we talk about Kava to preserve its unregulated status and to keep it off the DEA's and FDA's radar."

do you mean things like getting krunked etc?

Krunked, Shellfaced, etc., I don't know how damaging these terms are to Kava. They are humorous terms that only us Kava drinkers would understand, but they could easily be misunderstood too. Thats what we need to talk about. I just wrote a short example of a sensationalized news report headline, and decided not to post it because of the language they are going to use to describe Kava... Lets talk. Terms like, high, stoned, benzo, etc, should not be used to describe Kava. 8 years ago, I used to be a member of Edot when it was at its peak. Edot was an ethnobotanical community that knew that if they described the psychoactivity of the plants, it would simply bring government attention to those plants. It was a great policy. I would propose that here.

Talk about the chemotypes, the various levels of lactones, talk about relaxing properties, the mood lifting properties, but stay away from direct drug comparisons, or making kava sound like a drug rather than an herb in its effects. There really isn't any need to mention any drug by name on here as it just dirties the reputation of Kava out in public for anyone to read. Lets think about how we can do our part.

 

[ApéroNoble]

100% agree, kava has helped so many get off these very things like benzos which are prescribed to millions with awful effects as well as addictive things people self medicate themselves with like alcohol.

 

[infraredz]

I completely agree. The term "krunk" rubbed me the wrong way from the time I read it on the old forum years ago. What's worse is the direct comparisons to other drugs.

However, I think that there is a much more "recreational" approach to kava on other forums but it is not nearly as discussed in those forums. This forum is really exploding and is continually growing so much so that it appears in the first few results in pretty much any search that includes "kava" as a keyword.

I think the older members all agree and are on the same page with this, but we get so many new members that it's hard to keep up. Even if un-moderated, most don't seem to stay very long.

I know @Kapmcrunk has a little notice that is sent when one registers, so putting an emphasis on this might help with that.

 

[The Kap'n]

Stickied this thread. We need to rally behind this.

I have, however, always found it funny how even the DEA isn't necessarily classifying kava as something dangerous and is actually quite truthful in the effect profile.

 

[JonT]

Interesting! The statements on that document didn't strike me as particularly ridiculous. The positive comparison with alcohol is nice to see. It does seem a bit more balanced and accurate than some of the Australian government junk that is out there.
Are you proposing contacting them in any way via the email address they provide?

Edit: the most concerning part was referring to it as a "drug of abuse" in parts of Northern Australia coupled with "serious social problems". There is a lack of balance there. A real lack of balance. It also gives the impression, amongst other things, that kava is physically addictive.

 

[HeadHodge]

...I would like to include a section in there for the AKA.
So I've added a Kavapedia Tag for you to use....

It's in The Kavapedia Digest now. Thanks Much!!! Good Luck with the AKA.

 

[HeadHodge]

... Should post be deleted with some of the above mentioned things you're speaking to....

NAY. Free Speach or Death!!! (I'm actually serious about this)

 

[HeadHodge]

I completely agree. The term "krunk" rubbed me the wrong way from the time I read it on the old forum years ago. What's worse is the direct comparisons to other drugs.....

If I understand what you're saying, I guess I have to take exception to that. I like getting "krunked". It has saved me from my alcohol addiction. It's a term that has helped me cope. So I wouldn't want to be shunned for doing it. Also, if you want to be picky shouldn't a name like Kapmcrunk be banned forever??? Honestly, I think it's stupid.

(Late Edit: I actually think Kava should be accepted for recreational use, not just medicinal purposes. I mean what's the use of going to a Kava Nakamal if you can only go there when your sick??? ask KavaPig)

 

[HeadHodge]

....Stickied this thread....

Ha, beat you to it, got my tag from Tyler before you could sticky it!!

 

[infraredz]

If I understand what you're saying, I guess I have to take exception to that. I like getting "krunked". It has saved me from my alcohol addiction. It's a term that has helped me cope. So I wouldn't want to be shunned for doing it. Also, if you want to be picky shouldn't a name like Kapmcrunk be banned forever??? Honestly, I think it's stupid.

(Late Edit: I actually think Kava should be accepted for recreational use, not just medicinal purposes. I mean what's the use of going to a Kava Nakamal if you can only go there when your sick??? ask KavaPig)

I didn't really explain that as well as I should have. Basically, I think that the fact that you (and many others) have been able use kava to stay off alcohol, that is a positive experience that is yet another positive account of Kava helping people which is what this is all about. The term "krunk" just has a different connotation for me because I am in recovery and don't want to see kava as a way to get intoxicated. However, that's just my opinion based on my experiences and such. To this day, I don't consume anything (even coffee) in a recreational manner which is what "krunk" seems to elicit.

In all honesty, I don't think that people using that term around here (within reason) is an issue in the image of kava because there are much more negative accounts, descriptions and comparisons that are drawn on more "druggy" sorts of forums. That's really what I think the real issue is.

That all being said, since we are becoming a very visible "image" of kava, we should be careful on how we describe it, though like I said above, I think that the problem is more prevalent amongst the newer people that might come here after hearing about it elsewhere. It's clear that you, and Kapm (and the vast majority of our members) are respectful of the plant and don't contribute anything negative in terms of image.

The real problem is what the DEA is saying is that there are accounts of users using kava for relaxation and slight euphoria. This is an unescapable situation for us because, after all, that's what kava does. We can't really talk about a substance that is inherently relaxing and euphoric (although I've always contended it doesn't give me euphoria, but rather a feeling of being content). I think that there are some times though, that it appears some users consume kava to the point of significant intoxication. I can't stop that, and I do have my own prejudices and such like I said before, but I do think that we should be more mindful in that way.

 

[HeadHodge]

I didn't really explain that as well as I should have.....

Thanks for the clarification. I apologize if I came across a little snappy or snarky. It was really late last night, and I know better to not post stuff when I'm that tired.

So to summarize my point: I "personally" think that recreational use of Kava is But excessive abuse of Kava is

It's the same difference to me as having a few glasses of a good wine for dinner opposed to sitting down and chugging a straight fifth of Southern Everclear. I've done both, and know which one is recreational and which one is outright abuse.

So maybe we could come up with and promote a better term that is the equivalent of "got a good buzz going on" instead of one the implies "I'm totally ripped and hammered". But I don't think we should shun people for how they use Kava, because no matter what they do with it, it's way better than the alternatives out there. But rather, gently encourage a better way through education and support.

 

[infraredz]

Thanks for the clarification. I apologize if I came across a little snappy or snarky. It was really late last night, and I know better to not post stuff when I'm that tired.

No worries at all, I didn't feel that at all and I also didn't really word my post as well as I should have.

So to summarize my point: I "personally" think that recreational use of Kava is But excessive abuse of Kava is

It's the same difference to me as having a few glasses of a good wine for dinner opposed to sitting down and chugging a straight fifth of Southern Everclear. I've done both, and know which one is recreational and which one is outright abuse.

Absolutely. There's no reason that kava can't be enjoyed by people that aren't using it for "medicinal"-like purposes. It should be seen as a substance just like coffee; you could drink a ton of red bulls and get completely jittery or you could have a cup of coffee in the morning to get up and ready for the day.

So maybe we could come up with and promote a better term that is the equivalent of "got a good buzz going on" instead of one the implies "I'm totally ripped and hammered". But I don't think we should shun people for how they use Kava, because no matter what they do with it, it's way better than the alternatives out there. But rather, gently encourage a better way through education and support.

I think that just stating the effects would be a good start. I mean, in our review forms we have: Euphoria, Relaxation/Sedation, Muscle Relaxation, etc. These terms are much more appropriate than "I'm so f***ing krunked I can't walk straight".

Just to further elaborate on my previous point about the origin of the internet accounts they are referring to, I did a search for "kava h*gh" (trying not to get this indexed like what I'm about to describe...)
Anyways, the results for that originate from "druggy" forums.
(Click the image to see what I mean)

I think that while our community continues to grow in both size and online presence, though, that we should keep these things in mind as Tyler said (and we have all agreed on).

I think he summed it up well by this:
"Talk about the chemotypes, the various levels of lactones, talk about relaxing properties, the mood lifting properties, but stay away from direct drug comparisons, or making kava sound like a drug rather than an herb in its effects. There really isn't any need to mention any drug by name on here as it just dirties the reputation of Kava out in public for anyone to read. Lets think about how we can do our part."

 

[JonT]

Ugh. Dru*s-for*m.com. SWIM. SWIY. My Cat. Your cat.

 

[yepimonfire]

The recent DEA microgram on Kava states that the DEA is basically building their case against Kava based upon Kava drinkers accounts of their experiences on the internet. I would like to remind the members of the Kava forum of the role that they play in keeping Kava legal and unregulated simply by changing the way that Kava is discussed on public forums such as this one. Reading through some of the posts on here, I see a lot of language that is used to describe illicit substances, in fact I see several mentions of illicit substances. Its essential to not compare Kava to XYZ substance or talk about how _______ Kava gets you. Lets discuss how we as a community can change the way that we talk about Kava to preserve its unregulated status and to keep it off the DEA's and FDA's radar.

Wouldn't worry about it. It's just on their list of watches substances. Until people start showing up in hospitals from overdose, people start doing crazy things etc, nothing will happen. Shit I don't even wanna get off the couch drinking kava, much less drive or do something dumb.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Paradise Kava]

Excellent we are discussing the boundaries of which words are best used to express ourselves and the effects of kava.
It's no easy task since Kava is unlike any other; this thread can do wonders on we can relearn how to discuss kava "freely"
Annoying, sure.
Necessary, yes.

 

[Vekta]

This is a good post. I'm adding this to the package of links and articles I send people that are interested in kava.

I agree...it's annoying but very necessary.