Is the kava presence male or female?

[ThePiper]

Simple question. Is it female like "Mary" or is it male? I think there are some who automatically think that all plants that have a psychoactive relationship with humans are female in essence. I dont quite feel that way. I actually cant be certain with kava though. I guess I would say I unconsciously lean toward male for this particular plant, but that opinion is subject to change.

What is your personal interpretation based on your relationship with kava? What do the indigenous users think?

 

[KavaKitty]

I would say female, but that's probably because I do feel that plants, and earth-based gifts in general, are female, based on the "Mother Nature" concept. Plus, it's gentle like a female. Unless you overdo it, then it will kick your ass. Good question, great thread!

 

[Groggy]

I think of it as a female as well, nurturing & good to me. As @KavaKitty puts it, "Mother Nature" has the obvious feminine connotation, never gave it much thought till' now.

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

Yeah I feel female but also I feel that all things have both energies.
It could be down to the very kava plant your ingesting.
I've always felt tobacco to be female but the Native Americans call it Father tobacco. Although it could be the rustica that is more male idk ! Great question

 

[verticity]

In indigenous legends it is female

 

[verticity]

Similar legend in Tonga:

 

[Sacred Journey]

Kava is somewhat androgenous to me but if I had to venture I guess i would lean towards male.

 

[ThePiper]

Glad I'm not the only one. One of my friends agrees too that it seems kinda male. I definitely find tobacco (rustica) to be male as well.

 

[Zac Imiola (Herbalist)]

Yeah regular baccy I feel to be female for sure and have never had "father tobacco"

 

[currentbun]

Hmm. Interesting concept. I view it as genderless. I'm probably heavily influenced by my daughter's culture of genderization studies.

 

[verticity]

Hmm. Interesting concept. I view it as genderless. I'm probably heavily influenced by my daughter's culture of genderization studies.

"Genderization Studies"? Is that where you study how to assign genders to things that don't intrinsically have gender (like kava plants, which reproduce asexually..) This is also known as "learning many languages such as German, French or Spanish (or even Old English)"

For example
French:
The Sun = le soleil (Male)
The Moon = la lune (Female)

German:
The Sun = Die Sonne (Female)
The Moon = Der Mond (Male)

Makes perfect sense, right??

 

[currentbun]

That was good @verticity
If you change the angle just a tad, you're almost right. It's more about the how and why society assigns gender and what it stereotypically means. And it also relates to how and why the label has meaning and to whom it has meaning. In this case, we're really talking masculinity or femininity, which is actually not the same, but the labels seem to be intrinsically tied, so it's about why this should change.

 

[ThePiper]

Ok Im game. Im all about society being cool with masculine women and feminine men, but whats wrong with keeping these terms around? In my mind both labels have positive and negative traits. As a man I would like to think that I'm in touch with me feminine side, but its interesting because my mind sees that part of me as the "other" inside me. Ok I think I'm understanding mhy I want to call kava a male... I see kava as a substance that is somehow "like" me. Like it's not complimentary like, say, that girl mary, its instead something that take root in my conscious. I identify strongly with that feeling. I hope that makes sense. When I tried rustica tobacco I felt that it was male, for more reasons that werent so personally. It was rough and stern, stereotypically male. But it also manifested itself as a voice inside my mind, but a voice that was my own, like my mind was trying to explain something to itself. Weird plant huh. Kava is more easy for me to understand though!

 

[verticity]

I guess if I had to assign a gender to kava based on stereotypical gender roles, I would have to say it is female. (or I suppose I should actually say 'feminine') Kava is gentle, sensitive, nurturing, causes one to open up to others. I would contrast this with alcohol, which would be male (masculine): extreme, dangerous, prone to violence, generally whacks you over the head like a pharmacological phallus..

 

[currentbun]

Love the responses, guys!
@ThePiper I don't think there's anything wrong with the terms. Honestly, I just think it's funny that we adorn inanimate objects with sexual-based attributes at all anymore. Although typically cars and machinery are usually categorized as women, I've always felt my cars were men. Originally, it was because they kept me safe (no accidents!) and took care of my kids and all that, but since my daughter began studying gender roles (as they relate to society), I now question my original ideas.

I'm so glad you responded the way you have, because that's what I was hoping to hear. I'm playing devil's advocate a bit since my daughter has me questioning and opening my mind to these concepts that are new and different from what I knew and learned, so thanks for sharing that and being open to it.

@verticity I like your reasoning. Simple, but it does make sense so I'm actually going to agree with you. Kava=feminine for me, too.

 

[GussWest]

Kava = female
MJ = female
Psilocybes = male

 

[wormwood]

Seems like people have a natural tendency to ascribe female qualities to good things and male qualities to bad things

 

[verticity]

Seems like people have a natural tendency to ascribe female qualities to good things and male qualities to bad things

Well, it's a mixed bag actually--I was consciously trying to be "feminist" because for thousands of years that has not been the default.

For example, stereotypical masculine qualities could also be described in a positive way as: Strength, independence, leadership ability, self-confidence, decisiveness.

"Feminine" qualities could be negatively described as: Weakness, dependence, indecisiveness, passivity.

It just seemed to me that kava kind of embodies the positive traits that are stereotypically feminine. Although, of course, the existence of the stereotypes, both positive and negative for men and women I don't believe is a good thing.

 

[wormwood]

Well, it's a mixed bag actually--I was consciously trying to be "feminist" because for thousands of years that has not been the default.

For example, stereotypical masculine qualities could also be described in a positive way as: Strength, independence, leadership ability, self-confidence, decisiveness.

"Feminine" qualities could be negatively described as: Weakness, dependence, indecisiveness, passivity.

It just seemed to me that kava kind of embodies the positive traits that are stereotypically feminine. Although, of course, the existence of the stereotypes, both positive and negative for men and women I don't believe is a good thing.

Thats a good point. You're taking it a little deeper and further back than me. I guess I was thinking of all the experiences in my life, when I consider that (ie-people talking about their cars, idea etc.) its seems that the feminine trait is more often ascribed, and it is done so in a favorable manner. Which is fine by me, really. I generally trust women more than men, GENERALLY. Just an observation.

 

[ThePiper]

Ye both cases are true. I think of how a sailor might lovingly refer to his craft as "she" etc but also feminine is seen as negative, especially when placed in a position that is typically the masculine realm